Breaking barriers

[Eagle]

39 minutes ago, 30-30 said:




I never saw my sexuality as breaking the interspecies barrier. Breaking taboos, be it religious, cultural or sexual ones, never played any role for me. I applaud you for seeing the positive prejudices we as a community often fall for and would absolutely subscribe to this point of you of a severe lack of introspection into our own common beliefs and dogmata. Positive prejudice also is prejudice. 




But it isn´t exactly a secret that many are attracted to animals mainly because of thrillseeking and taboobreaking. And like with everything that grants adrenaline rushes, you can get addicted to that. I wouldn´t say it necessarily leads to hard drugs and paedophilia, but it´s also no secret that breaking the first taboo indeed makes breaking another taboo easier for some individuals. It´s not about resistance, it´s about what you truly are inside. 




The real problem behind moral and ethics codes is that everyone seems to create these on their own and for themselves. These moral codes exist , they´re called the zeta rules and have been constantly "adjusted, reinvented and adapted" over the years a.k.a. watered down to fit one´s own needs and beliefs.The most common denominator tactics. Until the moral scale reaches absolute zero regions.Because of "tolerance".




There are plenty of mass-followed "moral" and "ethical" codes that I consider a problem.  Many have "the word of god" telling their followers to treat nonbelievers (heathens, infidels, what-have-you) disrespectfully, and terrible bloody wars with high civilian death tolls have been waged purely because "my religion is right and yours is wrong!"






And now look around you....we´re constantly debating about even the most basic things like "zoo exclusivity" and where the line between beasty and zoo is to be drawn...so...how plausible does it seem to unite this "basket of flea" cornucopia of "zoos" under the same set of morals?




Its a very old fight predating my "delurk" into the zoo community in 1997 by several years.  There's cliquishness, "I'm a more devout follower of this club than thou!" one-upmanship in every group.






You made a very smart remark by saying that nothing happens in complete isolation. Yeah, true that...but let´s apply this piece of essential wisdom to , let´s say, the recently introduced laws against "zoophilia", shall we? Not one lawmaker enthusiastically said "I! I! I will take care of the animal fuckery!" out of the blue, so there have to be some reasons why this worldwide tsunami of new laws ran over our community...and can you guess what made lawmakers turn towards us? Could it be that our community in its total and sheepish belief in "tolerance" as THE core principle that outweighs everything else, even the most basic self preservation principles, is to blame? That we as a community have fooled ourselves into this hug box mentality where every criticism is seen as an attack, where every effort to bring our ethical principles to life again is seen as "intolerance" and "hate"? We lost our ideals, we dismissed the bouncer protecting us from nutjobs and impostors, we not only tolerated (sic!) those among us, we made them a part of our community...without further thoughts about what these folks will bring with them, trouble, public attention, drama and even the will to take our community hostage. In the name of "tolerance" , we dropped all our defenses and now we are honestly surprised that we are holding the charred remains of what once was hope for a better tomorrow for zoophiles in our bruised and battered hands. I said it before so many times.....Zoophiles are their own worst enemy. There is no way that an outsider or an anti could ever inflict so much damage to our community, our ideals and our future perspective in its sheepish submission to the "tolerance" dogma did. "Behold, the sword aiming at your heart...it is held by your own hand!"  




Actually, my perception is a variety of different events brought us into the limelight -- the infamous Jerry Springer episode with Hossie was a big one, and that was the "Zoophile Outreach Organization" intentionally putting us out there (which triggered quite a few states enacting anti-bestiality legislation), a myriad of bestiality stories making the news, probably the biggest of which was "Mr. Hands" ... a zoophile in my neck of the woods had years of experience going to a private zoophile gathering, having drinks and having sex with a stallion there, had a bit too much to drink and things went extremely badly; he was seriously injured, rupturing his colon, and despite the serious pain, the fear out outting led to a fatal delay in getting him any medical care; he was dropped off at a hospital but by then it was too late and he died.  This triggered an police investigation and, yeah, the police got their hands on porn, names, etc., and the news story made big headlines and this state where it happened quickly passed its first anti-bestiality legislation.  I think this story gets badly overlooked by those whom preach "never go to meets, don't share personal information, fuck animals in private and that's the way to be because that's the only safe and secure way" completely ignore -- it wasn't a law enforcement spying/infiltration that triggered the law enforcement and legislative army against us, but a death caused by a moment's recklessness by a zoophile at a private gathering strictly among very familiar zoophile friends.






About "bullying newbies"...well, that is directly connected to the paragraph before. What you call "bullying",  isn´t... if you want to keep out all the antisocial elements that otherwise would "crash your party, rape the dog and rip down the house", then I don´t see what is so damnable about a little "vetting" process applied to newbies. If our community only would have stuck to that principle from the first generation online zoos, a whole shitton of problems would have missed us, a whole lot of problems would not be the same huge size, so in the end, I don´t see why we should perpetuate this hug box mentality and put a falsely understood "tolerance" (a.k.a. indifference) above everything else. Example: Some reddit zoo sub users may remember a user called "Hedonist Glen". This guy was an absolute jerk, a misogynic bastard fencehopper claiming that "women are assholes for not liking him" while heput a "personal ad" as an "expert pussy licker" in another sub. Do you really want those toxic elements , in the name of "tolerance"? A vetting process at the "door" IS needed and should not be mistaken for "giving a weaker newbie a bad time for shits and giggles". We SUFFER from the "tolerance" dogma...and until this community has learned that simple fact, nothing will change because WE are UNABLE to change first.  




No, no, very much no.  It is bullying.  There is constructive criticism, yes, but its interspersed with irrational, illogical and unsupported condescension that is, absolutely, bullying/trolling, particularly given its concentrated on someone whom is, clearly, in pain and psychologically vulnerable.  This shit was done to me when I was a newbie, and there were people trying to give me constructive advice at the same time, but to me it all blended together.  You aren't able to learn something genuine if its delivered in an avalanche of trolling condescension, everything handed to you that's at all critical will blend together on the recipient.  I went through this, I've seen it hundreds of times, and its being done again.  The trounce-the-weakling mentality you defend I find I cannot trust to truly love any being beyond a sexual sense.  I've seen through it, I had one as a boyfriend, I have seen the underside of that shell and realized how abusive they were through and through ... find a sex dog, fuck it, throw it outside when done, bully some weaklings online.  I've been an eyewitness to this very close up.  I myself was the subject of this crap when I delurked, and I realized I couldn't see the genuine advice because of the avalanche of trolling shit that came with it.  






If there wasn´t this enormous discrepancy between in the principles we claim as ours and what we actually behave like everyday, with that "all inclusive" attitude, I could see what your criticism is aiming at, but as it is now, I´d say you´re missing out on an entire and essential part of the problem here. This community following the downward spiral of "more tolerance" actually is anger inducing to those of us who believe in values and definitions, besides the anger that is granted by emotional and horomonal imbalance that´s present in every human. "Strong men create good times. Good times create weak men. Weak men create bad times. Bad times create strong men." So, how much "bad times" does it need for you to do yourselves what you demand from society soooo desperately? Change?? 




I have abandoned my "all-inclusiveness."  Some traits I find intolerantly repugnant, even from someone else calling themselves a zoophile.  The "community" has never really been a unified, all-marching-in-step, and I'm less inclined than I used to be to try to make it such.  Every zoophile has weakness.  I am beyond sick and tired of this denial of mental and emotional troubles.  Its a complete shell and farce, its self-delusional and insensitive, and it makes one completely blind to the abuses one wreaks on others.  Being a troll or a bully does not require conscious thoughts of "I want to hurt this weakling for the sake of hurting them because I am evil!"  All it requires is ignoring pain one causes others.  Not considering yourself a bully is no more valid at determining if you are one than checking onesself for bad breath.  We are all self-blind and self-deluded.  If you haven't learned that, then you are completely oblivious to your effect on others, including whether or not you are a bully.






Yes, it´s true that everyone comes from a different background. But that´s not the problem here, the problem is watering down everything this community once stood for with rules like "the animal always comes first". We´ve had an overdose of "tolerance" and hug box mentality and it terribly backfired, yet still no one is wondering whether it´s actually US who have to readjust and change. I´m German and used to Merkel´s typical "Weiter so!" (just continue as usual) and thus I know where this leads to. Encrustation, apathy and rising anger. This community went down the same path long ago, the mechanisms are the same and the outcome will also be the same. Maybe...just maybe...could it be those "troublemakers" and "newbie attackers" are the logical "harvest" of sowing bad seeds of sheepish "indifferent tolerance"? And what about those troublemakers? Don´t you think that many of you incite this anger that leads to fighting and banning by dismissing every criticism without even giving one thought to whether they might be onto something, regardless of the tone they are using? Just take the now closed thread of cat as an example...this was about zoo exclusivity and who can call himself that. I was writing some replies in there also...and the most laid back answer to my posts came from Silverwolf who still grumpily said that he doesn´t care about labels. All the others were fighting like it´s about the last can of oxygen on Mars...for something they claim has no real use and is "just a label". Not very logical, if you ask me. So, could it be that a lot of the blame for the current situation is on YOU, the "oh so tolerant majority"...for not considering any criticism worth thinking about it, for dismissing critics with buzzwords and the usual "Totschlagargument" shtick of "You´re intolerant, hateful and I won´t listen to anything you have to say". This exact same arrogance of the "progressive, tolerant" folks was what made the conservatives rise again around the globe. I´m totally not on the alt-right side and despise the AfD, that hydrogen blonde Dutch moron, the hija de puta of LePen,Trump and his cronies from the bottom of my heart, but they actually bring up some (!) valid points about what went wrong in our society by mindlessly worshipping "tolerance" principles and this retarded SJW "culture". When criticism is dismissed categorically for "inciting fights" and "disturbing the peace", then things get nasty. As they got in our community over the years, with many of the good and genuine folks actually contributing to the discourse leaving because of this immovable, inadaptable irrational belief in "tolerance". For the community not even living up to its propagated principles for even one second, for all the ethical and moral principles being thrown away once pants are unzipped...and applauded by many in our community.




<font color="#c0392b" face="Georgia, serif">I really don't see that this "community" ever truly, genuinely stood for anything consistently.  I've heard espousements of ethics and morals from "zoophiles" whom I observed hitting or smacking their "lovers" and relegating them to a chain outside of fucking time.  I was badly admonished myself from hypocrites.  I hero-worshipped a few zoophiles, including Hossie -- but then found out the terrible conditions his animals were in.  One of his roommates visited once with one of his Great Danes, so rife with ticks I filled a shot glass with them pulling those ticks out.  I didn't say anything at the time, just focused on pulling them out.  She was nervous and afraid of me at first, but while I imagine the pinching and such I was doing to pull those ticks out wasn't pleasant, she quickly took an appreciative liking to me, just over the few hours she was visiting with her pet human.</font>




Many would call me a troublemaker too, and maybe they´re right about that. But ,as you said, nothing happens in total isolation, and we troublemakers are no exception to that rule. So I demand the same you demand here from me, meditate about those troublemakers and why they´re acting the way they do. Could it be they´re onto something that terribly needs to be adressed in our community? That it´s those who see a bit farther than the common tolerazombie. I as one of those assholes have predicted the current situation back in the nineties already: I said  "if we as a community can´t keep our own turf clean, can´t implement a binding set of rules that is obligatory to obey to for memebership in our community without and debate and bargaining, we soon will be marginalised and made punishable before the law". Sadly, everything went exactly like I predicted. Now we have the mess...and a shitload of "zoos" who go the path of least resistance and solely blame "the society" for what this has become. Pointing fingers at "the unjust and hateful people" ...so, everything is comfy, everything is black-and-white. "They" are evil and "we" are saints. "They" are absolute shit, but "we" never make mistakes, not even a single one although reality says otherwise. Without a total reformation and renewal, our community will face its demise soon, the total and irreversible moral bankruptcy is immiment..in the name of "tolerance". "Nibelungentreue" beyond death...the golden calf you´re all dancing around while your world is crumbling around you. Apathy. Indifference. Trench fight mentality , "us" versus "them". Tribalism. Welcome to the jungle...

I have pondered this a lot, and essentially my determination is not that we need to "cull the weak,"  we need to reign in the trolls and we very much need -- all people do, really -- to work to throw out our notions of mental illness and take a much healthier stance on it, much as better people focus on their physical fitness.  Viewing emotional and mental unwellness as a weakness combined with proudly espousing being drama-free creates a very confident and convincing self-image that is completely false, and blinds every one whom builds such an emotional shell as to their abusive effects on others.  I have not just been around this block several times, I've been deeply in the basement, between the walls and underneath the foundations of the buildings on this block.