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Bestia Amore: a new Zoo Podcast!
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09-05-2020, 03:48 PM
Here's my problem, with both of you. You are all telling me, what I have heard before. I'm not stupid, nor am I blind to the happenings around me. I lurk, watch.. I K N O W what the hell is going on with us. Difference here? I'm not paranoid and wearing tinfoil hats everywhere. I'm sorry, but that accomplishes N O T H I N G. I'm tired of a whole lot of nothing getting done for us, OR our partners. 
09-05-2020, 08:12 PM
Quote: Many of the "Crusaders" (who I shall not name, you should know who they are, or were) have done a HUGE amount of harm and contributed drastically to our present situation, regardless of their best intentions, largely by attracting attention. Take care that you don't repeat their "successes". "First do no harm". 
09-06-2020, 12:39 AM
Quote: I get that you are frustrated with the lack of options for zoos to feel apart of society. We all feel it two, it's one of the major things that run through my mind as well. When you go out for walks, or step outside your door. When you join a dog park, or care for other animals. This is not just a zoo problem, it's a sex problem. No human thinks about sex or love nearly as often as we do. They probably spend, what, a week if that in a "healthy" relationship before they get some love making from their partner. Animals undoubtedly live shorter lives than humans. If you've ever wondered how a vampire feels when watching mortals grow up, old and then somehow don't exist anymore, it's like that for us in a way. We're absolutely committed to our pack, heard and collective family no matter what race we bond with. That's never going to change no matter who is against us. What I see, is not a lot of emphasis coming from anyone about your commitment to this fact first and foremost. It is something so ingrained into me, it's become subconscious. Safety, well being and free will are the 3 basic reasons I have for being intelligent, not mindless. Focused is another issue entirely. I think we can all agree that focus is a tool of learning for everyone, no matter their species to come to grips with from time to time. It's this focus I want to address. Because, in and of itself, the biggest issues zoophiles face is not the stigma from being outed by people. It's the lack of support driven by others who do not understand who we are, internally. That we have common ideas which unite us beyond the divides that do not. And this goes for us as well, to understand humans in turn. This is not something animals will know the distinction of, until it is too late for them. This is what we have to be smart about to defend. When ever I am frustrated, I look back on what I tried to do and smile. Because it's the thought that counts no matter what. It's getting there that's the biggest challenge for anyone to have to face. It's one thing to do so alone, thinking you have everything in hand. It's another, to realize you can rely on someone for their commitment in the moment. For humans and animals, our relations are that moment on a constant basis. Even more so when animals have to suffer at the hands of humans even for non zoo related practices of continuous cruelty and sacrifice, just for being in close proximity. The frustration I feel, at the larger outer circle community of zoophiles, one we've all been in at some point. Is based off of this misunderstanding that is not being corrected when ever someone else starts a new project. Their focus as a project leader, is entirely on the community of inner circle zoos. Who feel like they're being represented. Those on the border between human and non human human relations, are completely trusting that this movement has weight for their own situation. Nobody is recognizing the distinction, and relatively identifying with the core issues only a regular zoophile would understand. That's when the real trouble starts, because you don't know who you're broadcasting to, unless you mean what you say when you do so, in a way that could save you or others only if plausible deniability can be achieved. This is how humans work through problems. When you're pinned, they already know enough to trap you. Think of this like a game of hunters versus hunted. You're constantly on the look out because you in someone's eyes, have slipped down the food chain to become prey. Avoid this at any cost, and you'll be doing interspecies relations the favour of the century. So when you inevitably will start your broadcast to the world, I want you to think about standing your ground where you can have some merit with it. Because that's what will give your show the backbone it needs for people to spread the word. It's only when trusted experience becomes popular, can another Beast forum viral growth spurt take hold. I see that you're committed, and nothing I, or Silver Wolf or Heavy Horse will say to change your mind. This is a learning experience for you, Winter Green Wolf, and I want it to be positive. We all do. We're worried you are only focusing on a plea for help, rather than a determination to essentially, act where your promise stands on this knowledge you'd like people to stand with you on. This is just a suggestion. Make a show, link it and then get criticism you can work with once it's live. You can always improve upon a base line. You will mostly get honest feedback from us, whose lived the lifestyle. Just remember, you have our experience to fall back on. We can't offer much emotional support because we ourselves are hiding in fear. You're addressing people whose had to accept this, sometimes the hard way. The long road to sanity, where we're fighting misunderstanding two. Focus on what we're all going through, and what we can do to change that if you will. Make this something positive for our community, and I'll be the first to even link to you on my profile here. Not that I'm a popular member or anything, but that I want to give support where it matters. Lets refocus your energy on what you can contribute, rather than the anger you feel at being rejected for people you clearly still respect. Because I think, you're going about the problem we all want solved, in a slightly angled direction. One that is fixable, if we can come to some common ground together. That's the movement that will inevitably bring more people to your show with key takeaways from it if they bother to listen and learn at the same time. The more who are able to reach out with its influence to people who can relate, the better a chance you'll have at plausible deniability if you truly have everything in order for that to make you stronger, if it can't kill or end what you're trying to achieve. That's what I know about you, is that you're a fighter, and now it's time to pick your battles and make strategic advances towards winning the ones you face. You're not there yet, but one day I want to say I'm proud to have made a difference because it worked, and we made a team effort from a common goal possible. That's the spirit of zoo activism at play.
09-06-2020, 01:08 AM
Quote: To put this bluntly and speak clearly, we're not sex machines, we're care givers. Not abusers, helpers. Not ignorant, respectable. If people can't see that about us, they can't see that about anyone else either. Likewise, if you can't see that tie that connects us, then others will see it is lacking in you and it will anger them. This does touch up on the argument between zoophiles and bestialists in a rather decisive way, one defining our future and education. Perhaps here's where blackmail can really come into favour if it has to be called fourth. We know who we aren't like, and if we can prove that care is a key part of human living, which it undoubtedly is. The people we need to convince the most, are the ones living in our outer circle. This is the difference. "Yes, I know John. Very attentive. Always walks his dog every morning, and helped stopped a dog fight the other day in the park. His Golden Retriever has always been well mannered, never had an issue." "Hmm, John. I hope you're not talking about the same John. Dark hair, about 5 3. Brown eyes and a sickly sweet shit eating grin on his face. I never knew him, but his neighbour across the way...thinks he seen him abusing his dog. Yeah, the same one that tried to hump someone the other day in the dog park. I was there and I saw him panic, but he didn't seem shocked about his behaviour. IF he was, I never heard the usual scolding from embarrassment most dog owners would identify with." Examples: that's what that was in quotes. Regarding how other people see you in relation to spreading information or disinformation, in the human world. They tend to look the other way, unless the facts that stare them in the face are ones they can relate with. It can't be bad things if it's good in their eyes. Everyone has to start somewhere. But in context, it will grow or whither depending on how people perceive you. If a non zoo looks at your podcast and says, this guy is advocating for the protection of animals and believes that rape should be avoided. The trick is proving this issue exists, outside religious contexts if people are willing to listen. If not, that's on them. But if they are, and you're lacking backbone, they will come after you thinking you're one of the worst. Thanks to outer circle zoophile members being involved. That's my number one issue with Zooier than thou. It's target audience is absolutely without a doubt, the inner circle zoo. Yes, it's got backbone. But what could protect it, is someone being a type of buffer between the jokes that inevitably get passed around, and the values that are commonplace believed at heart by everyone. Lets see what you come up with. 
09-06-2020, 11:35 AM
Quote: Because you don't see it, (or don't want to) it doesn't exist.. Whatever. Like I said, Good luck with your podcast. Though you've got to learn to be a lot less quick to be put on the defensive out there than you were in here among friends. Out there it'll ruin ya. I will ask you this though, the same question I've asked all before you and it's meant in all earnest: What exactly do you believe YOU can provide myself and my companions that we do not already have by your podcast? (Since it is not simply for the education and protection of fellow zoophiles, as I originally thought): I'll tick off a couple things I don't need, to save you time. Legality: To do what? Have sex with my own dog? I already do. (or did, in my case) I don't need an audience, so am unlikely to face any penalty of any law saying I cannot. Such laws ARE currently my best protection against some other moron trying to rape her though, or my horses. Let the Laws stand or provide a better option against that. (That work IS already being done though, so...) Or perhaps to say I'm a "Zoophile" or "Bestialist". Again, why? Do hetero's have to shout it from the streets? Neither do I. Freedom: To be a "zoophile"? I already am free to be one. Some say you have no choice but to be one. I personally don't. I choose the individuals who I love, human or not. That's Freedom. Not all agree with me on that, but many do. Spaying/neutering: Here's a good one for you to tackle though. Talk about real paranoia in the zoo community, this a hot issue for it. I don't need a push against spaying and neutering. I DO need a push, an education of zoophiles themselves, on safe and responsible breeding; talking to their Vets about alternative spay options; and population control. I have seen too many "zoophiles" allow animals to suffer out of combinations of fear and unintended over-breeding over the decades. This "hoarder" image is one aspect of the negative image normal folk have of zoophiles that has to be changed from with-in. Make an impact here. Tell me what else you CAN do. Tell me why to listen to you, to follow you. Or are you, like so many others, just out to make yourself a 'name' with no clear agenda? sw
09-06-2020, 12:46 PM
(This post was last modified: 09-06-2020, 01:59 PM by heavyhorse.)
Quote: QUOTE: WGW said: I'm tired of a whole lot of nothing getting done for us, OR our partners. There's a deep undercurrent, has been in other Crusades and this one as well, and <a contenteditable="false" data-ipshover="" data-ipshover-target="<___base_url___>/profile/3633-elshara/?do=hovercard" data-mentionid="3633" href="<___base_url___>/profile/3633-elshara/">@elshara</a> , that if "we" can only project our ethics and morals effectively for all to see, all or large parts of the general population will come around to our side, that the problem to date has been a failure to project how truly wonderful we are to a broad enough audience, and doing so will overcome the world's resistance. N.O.T. G.O.N.N.A. H.A.P.P.E.N. Sorry, just won't. Millions of years of evolution and thousands of years of nationality and organized religion have seen to that. The purpose of sex, love, family, caring, protection, is simply "go forth and multiply". Outbreed the other nations, religions, cover the planet with humans "like us". This is ingrained so deeply in culture and biology that there is frankly no event I can imagine that will make a dent. We (critter people of all stripes) are an abomination and traitor to our species to even consider other species as alternative to fellow humans. There it is, sorry. And in this climate becoming more visible does nothing to change minds, it's simply a pop-up target for humanity's wrath. More legislation, more prosecution, more oversight. If it seems like some blogging may help an "inner core" critter people vs "margins" issue (which I don't see but that's OK), then have your blog on existing "zoo" venues, for zoos, not social media; the "normie" world doesn't want it or need it, and we don't need them to. And I for one was glad to see BF go. It served the industrial porn industry, not us. Quote: Be that as it may, we were born human. Not all humans are bad. Most of them fail to see us for our strengths, due to the fact we have so little in common with their total authoritarian control issues. Religion is of course a one sided affair. That's why people who are also one sided, gravitate towards it so strongly. I'm talking jealous people with a bone to pick on anyone who is not like them. Basically, the mirror effect. If you can or can't see yourself in others. This comes down to greed. When you have $100.00, you want $5.00 to put towards that regular $10.00 sandwich from Subway. When you have $200.00, you want $20.00 to buy the sandwich and a drink, and cookies, chips and milk from the store. What happened to just the sandwich? Well you got distracted by a price tag that says on sale while supplies last at participating locations. This happens all the time, and people spend more than they need to in order to feel secure (temporarily) with the world around them. What happens when that sense of security shifts, though? To people who aren't like them. To zoophiles. People like us. Well, just like until the food is eaten, consumed or put away in ones fridge. Humans won't stop, because they're paid not to, at anything but justice. And if they will take a mile from an inch, absolutely they'll try. They think they're in the right as well. They also think they're in the right when they spend more out of greed two. But nobody tells them they can't, and they think they've outgrown that permission from their parents because they have a fancy job, with a badge on it that makes them a living. Religion has very little to do with anything but providing a subconscious backbone for zoophile stigma. Science, teaches us about the food chain, and how animals naturally live. The cycles of predators and prey. And the means by which a natural biodiversity ecosystem works. Nowhere in the indoctrination of Christianity, or any other major religion, science, etc does it say species will have sex lives other than to procreate. But yet, here we all are doing just that. Jealousy and unwillingness to even talk about homosexuality in just humans and other species alone, faces scientific rap over the fact that some birds and lions and other animals can and will choose same sex partners to live their lives with. Why? Because that's apart of their being, and who they gravitate to on the inner level. And it also has a lot to do with circumstance, where perhaps no male or female is available. Again, you don't see documented evidence of animals masturbating in many science texts, but it's been proven. So whose making pro personal choices now? No scientific system is as exact as the one which governs atomic relationships. In electronics, that's done with numbers. In organic life, the spirit takes charge. And absolutely a non religious spiritual pull is real and alive on this planet. IT stands to show not many zoophiles are aware of this, but yet feel the pull to their animals and have done so while very young. Being attracted to someone who takes on a different form than you, is apart of nature. It's not perverse, it's special. Why? Because it's a mutual bond and or relationship. All the humans industrial revolution stands for today, is to build platforms consisting of greed atop of. But hell, the 20th century alone has been one of the most free, particularly 1956-2005 we've ever seen on this planet as far as mass acceptance of people is concerned. No society is without its problems, and hidden dark times, not even our own. Least of all regular human based relations. Acceptance is key. That's if anything, what people blog about. There's a lot to be said for new thought versus wishful thinking arguments. Sometimes, we have to pull back to take a look at the bigger picture. And other times, we have to see who else has already made steps to do so. But to lose sight of that completely, gives us a dead end. And that's where the big picture movement was born from, seeing beyond it when people feel more than sense, the need to do so. It's like I told Winter Green Wolf in my previous post. I understand his frustration. I do still think there's a ways to go before he can become a representative of another independent, but equally as impressive voice for the zoophile community if he tries, seeing as how he's said so hard he has everything in order. Which, I doubt considering he's just said in so many words across all the posts he's made in this thread, and little else to back it up. I also get where you're coming from. IT takes the right person to stand up and be brave. Nobody's perfect. People will either take ideas and run with them, use them to achieve a mutual relationship or close them off once their purpose or call was fulfilled. We are a minority. We've agreed to distance ourselves because now isn't the right time to openly proclaim our love for non humans. I get that, and support, respect and adhere to it because it has a real enough merit to save the majority of zoophiles from problems later on. How much would it take? for generations of this being told to younger outer circle zoos who have the energy to break this protective isolation around us and our loved ones before we see justice? These are questions I think about often. I want someone to address them who is like us, because there's two camps of zoophiles out there now. The older geneeration who hides, and the younger generation who doesn't hide. The stupid ones, are the people who take unnecessary risks. But what those risks are, only mean something when they form a cause, a movement and a discovery that's more important. On a personal level, nothing is more so than our mates and our safety and well being. That will never ever change. But on a social level, we do represent a collective. And that collective needs a future, come what may. IT needs to be told, experienced and lived. We need to not be, feel or desire to have to live alone. Everyone knows how it was for them in the beginning. At the very least, those stories are still relevant today and will endeavour to be the case for thousands of years. We need to hold the vision of a better time in our hearts, so we can work towards achieving it quietly now while we're living in isolation. That's inevitably what someone else will do in their time. I have no wish to prolong our acceptance to suffer for who we are. That's where this message from my heart truly comes from. And at the end of the day, once it's in motion, such a plan will succeed. But this post isn't about what the future holds, it's about a podcast with the issues that face us right now. Like I said, Winter Green Wolf has a long way to go to be unique in this area. I only wish the best for him and his friends in this field if they are seriously committed to it. If not, I'm glad we all spoke up. I personally wouldn't podcast myself, but that's only because I know better. I'm still out, but thinking there's a solution to things even if we don't see it now. Who knows. Maybe he won't be the voice of a future zoo star. All I can say is, we know what we want and are going to put our lives and our animals first. Show or no show.
09-06-2020, 02:35 PM
Right, unfollowed this topic. Also, not going to bother posting here further after this, mainly because this is repetitive and not going anywhere. Also, I'll likely think twice before posting any sort of new ideas here, seeing as I'm dealing with the most paranoid, deluded people I've spoken to in a while. Take this topic where you want folks. Quote: That jab was as cold as what your name implies. I'm, impressed.
09-06-2020, 04:16 PM
Quote: Paranoid: imaginary feeling of being targeted or pursued by others. It's not imaginary. Deluded: 1. believing things that are not real or true. Our beliefs are supported. By personal experiences, legislation, prosecutions, recent history, failed platforms, previous efforts. (BTW, support taking your statements from "deluded" to "facts" is notably lacking.) Good luck. I hope you groundbreaking success. |
