Hi all. I thought I would get a sense of the community here as to a question I frequently wonder about. I owe much of my curiosity to my limited long-term practical experience, but also to sheer academic interest...this is an area of human knowledge that is extremely poorly explored. I'm also hoping to stimulate some discussion on how zoos in general socialize with their partners immediately before and after sex (in particular, how ought we).
I realize that this can vary from species to species, as well as by the exact kind of relationship, individuals, and sexes involved. However, what is the ratio (in your experience, honestly) of how much you have been solicited for sex by a member of another species, versus how much you have solicited sex from a member of another species? How many requests from partners versus how many requests from you, to put it more concisely. Numbers don't have to be exact...an anecdotal ratio or percentage would suffice.
To follow up on this, for those with a lot of experience, feel free to play with these questions if you want. How do different species compare in terms of how readily they accept human mates? How do individuals vary inside of the same species? Are solicitation behaviors well understood by both parties, or does it take convincing or a lot of learning? Was there a (steep, easy, etc.) learning curve or adjustment period after first meeting your partner(s), who presumably never had a human mate before? How did that adjustment/learning happen (what was the process like)? Do they continue to exhibit their species' and sexes' usual breeding behaviors towards you, or do they learn to make changes? What kind of changes have they made?
Answering the last part first for Tippy & Shadow (who I had the most experience with), sex with them was nothing like sex with their own species. They disliked "doggie style" with me, each preferring a different position and each having different cues that they wanted sex.
Tippy preferred missionary. She would ask (She initiated our first encounter btw) by first driving her nose into my crotch then lying on her back pumping her vulva back and forth. If ignored, she'd do it over and over, whining until I unzipped. She'd do this anywhere. This accounted for most of the times she'd "ask" She had other ways too.
Shadow preferred face to face on our sides, in bed at night at home. She was real particular. She would "ask" only maybe 25% of the time, by presenting in front of me, flagging then jumping on the bed and getting on her side. The only time she wanted to be in the bed was when we made love, so... She'd accept sex elsewhere too, but preferred it on her terms.
After sex... With Tippy, it was a race! The whole house and most of the ranch got a workout. She would spring out of bed right after and immediately dive under it and "nest". This is where a bitch digs and paws a depression into the soil of a hole to have her pups. Dogs will sometimes imitate that under furniture. I'd dress, or not, then we'd chase each other through the place for a good 15 minutes. We'd finish in the shower, both of us, if home. If not home, I'd dress quick while she ran around then play chase with her and we'd continue hiking or whatever we were doing.
With Shadow, we'd shower together, then cuddle for a good long while. She loved the cuddle more than the sex I think. I remember the cuddles more now that she's gone.
With other dogs it's a toss-up. Sometimes just a fingerstroke along the vulva is all it took to get them interested. Sometimes nothing would, then you walk away. Some have asked me with a tail flag and a push of the rump and meant it, some have done the same and only wanted their butt scratched. It's more than just body language.
sw
I will limit my response here to bitches since that is what I have the most experience with. For a rough ratio I would say it is something like 3:1 where my current canine partner initiates. When it comes to other dogs I would say it is probably 4:1 with me initiating. There are some cases with other dogs where I see them regularly and the ratio might drop more to 1:1. The basic point in those numbers though is the ones that have learned that the contact is good are more likely to seek it out.
With the bitches that seek it out the behaviour is pretty standard and they do one of a number of things. Either present themselves in the typical standing heat pose with tail flagged and back arched, start getting more "in your face" by presenting themselves closer and closer, pawing for attention whilst presenting, mounting, rubbing their vulva against me, etc. When I initiate I generally start by rubbing around their vulva and going from there hoping to work up to basic penetration where I can stimulate her enough to get her off.
I have been lucky enough to have played with a lot of bitches and have experienced everything from a bitch that wouldn't let you touch her at the peak of her standing heat to ones that one man could never satiate. The ends of the spectrum are rare and most tend to fall in the middle. The few I've known that didn't want any sexual interaction didn't really have anything in common with one another though there are factors that can make the process take more time such as past abuse/trauma and breed traits like skittishness. Even if you both want it right away there are physical factors to overcome such as how impossibly tight she might be. When I adopted my current girl I went about seeing how she'd respond to sexual play after she'd had a couple weeks to settle in and despite her immediate positive reception it took just over two weeks of play to gently stretch her out enough to take me. This isn't an attempt on my part to proclaim how massive I am in that department but just a simple reality that is rarely spoken about for some reason - most virgin bitches cannot physically accommodate a human male right away.
As an aside I've noticed a few breed characteristics over the years. Rottweilers seem to be one of the easiest breeds to successfully have fun with. I have played with 7 Rotty bitches over the years and have experienced an enthusiastic response from every single one. I have had my best fun by far with Rotties - they are fantastically enthusiastic partners sexually and in every other way. German Shepherds IMO feel the best. They seem to have this ability to remain tight the entire way through the fun. I am struggling to described the feeling but it is like a silky gentle squeezing that never goes away. All bitches tend to be intensely tight and squeeze but with German Shepherds it is just more pronounced and isn't lost or minimised through the act.
As far as socialising goes it really depends who I am having fun with. With my own partner she does the typical go crazy thing when sex is over but soon settles and is very cuddly. If it is a night session or just a day session where I don't need to do anything then I'll usually stay in bed with her cuddling for a long while afterwards. With others it depends entirely on the situation and what they want - some want to cuddle, some want to just continually go crazy and run around, some want to go out, some just want to clean up and go to sleep.
I am not really a man of romance when it comes to other bitches I might get to have sex with. The romance is kind of reserved for those I have a close bond with and I don't think it has to be a factor to have sex. As long as I have permission, she is receptive, welcoming, consenting and we can both have fun then that is what we do.
Another aside before I wrap up this rambling and fairly random reply... dogs can have a sense for intent, doubt, guilt, etc. All dog lovers zoo or not will likely say that but rarely does it seem to be considered in the context of a zoosexual relationship or fling. Most male zoos I know who have failed with having fun with their bitch (or others) did so because they approached it full of concern, nervousness and doubt. It is a mistake a lot of new zoos make and unfortunately once a bitch gets the idea that sex is in any way negative it can often be the end for any fun at all. There is going to be much more success achieved when it is approached confidently with the intention in mind of pleasuring her, having some fun and seeing where it goes.
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3 hours ago, Thunder-Bay-Syd said:
. When I adopted my current girl I went about seeing how she'd respond to sexual play after she'd had a couple weeks to settle in and despite her immediate positive reception it took just over two weeks of play to gently stretch her out enough to take me. This isn't an attempt on my part to proclaim how massive I am in that department but just a simple reality that is rarely spoken about for some reason - most virgin bitches cannot physically accommodate a human male right away.
Very, very true, and something for EVERY inexperienced zoo to keep in mind. You can quite quickly ruin any chances of a pleasurable experience for both of you or a long term relationship by trying to rush things. Tippy initiated our first time, and was surprisingly accommodating, leaving me wondering today if she wasn't already 'zoo' before I rescued her but Shadow took months after we decided to become lovers before we went for full vaginal sex. After the first few times she was as accommodating as her grandmother though. I've been with a few other bitches, before Tippy. Even if they have had multiple litters they are NOT going to easily take a human penis right away. Not as a rule IMO, not unless they JUST had puppies which is not a time to screw them. Take your time, and let them take theirs.
sw
It's usually my girl who initiates sex. She shows it by presenting her butt and partly lifting her tail. She can be insistent about it!
At first I asked myself if I was misreading the signal and maybe starting sex with her when all she wanted was affection, but when it's buttscratches she wants, she solicits them differently, by casually leaning the side of her butt against my knee. When she wants her pussy played with, she's more intense about it: she offers her back end directly and looks round her shoulder at me with a specific soft-eyed expression. By now I've learned that that look means she's ready to get humpy the moment I stroke her clitoris, where normally it takes a little while if she hasn't solicited me first.
Unlike some folks, we're not particularly romantic after sex. We may play a little, but in my current home that's tricky because it's hard to be certain the neighbours won't notice some aspect of a guy playing with the dog while sporting a wet erection. So mostly I'll want to wash myself, and she'll want to wash us both, and mostly I'll just end up petting her fur on the bed while she licks everything in sight, and that's our aftercare.
Since I happen to prefer big strong males, let me give you a view from the other side. Once a male of any species figures out which buttons to push to get himself an orgasm, he will push them at every available opportunity. With many, like my current (a stallion), simply not saying "No" quickly and forcefully will be treated as an invitation to foreplay. I have to admit that a lot of this is my own fault. It's not easy for me to walk away when that much raw sexual energy gets aimed in my direction. He knows that if he can get me to a certain point, we are going to fuck until I fall over.
What is most different about the equine point of view is that sex and affection are not really commingled. Lust is primarily another kind of hunger to be quickly and efficiently satisfied. Mutual orgasms provide superior stimulation but things happen so fast that they aren't a fast rule. Affection is more about trust and companionship. "I've got your back" is probably the ultimate expression of equine love.
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13 minutes ago, caikgoch said:
Once a male of any species figures out which buttons to push to get himself an orgasm, he will push them at every available opportunity.
Sounds about right. [img]<fileStore.core_Emoticons>/emoticons/laugh.png[/img]/emoticons/ [email protected] 2x" title="xD" width="20" />
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17 minutes ago, caikgoch said:
What is most different about the equine point of view is that sex and affection are not really commingled....Affection is more about trust and companionship. "I've got your back" is probably the ultimate expression of equine love.
I love this about horses. Have you ever felt that this was something that was unequal with your stallion partners? Do you have to trust him more than he trusts you? Or do you feel like you're in a marish kind of leadership role for him, and thus things are kind of different but equal?
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5 hours ago, Wolf Seeks Dog said:
Unlike some folks, we're not particularly romantic after sex. We may play a little, but in my current home that's tricky because it's hard to be certain the neighbours won't notice some aspect of a guy playing with the dog while sporting a wet erection. So mostly I'll want to wash myself, and she'll want to wash us both, and mostly I'll just end up petting her fur on the bed while she licks everything in sight, and that's our aftercare.
I think that's a totally reasonable approach and really sweet in its simplicity.
Thunder and silverwolf, I really appreciated all of your great insights. Thank you for all the detail. It seems to me that there is a lot of variability and that it's hard to generalize when it comes to female canines. They seem to be very individual on the zoo relationship front. Clearly, though, there can be a lot of initiative on both partners' parts and that they take to different mates pretty readily. I'm really surprised that most don't seem to like "doggy style" all that much!
Also I totally agree with Thunder and partly what caikgoch has said: sex doesn't necessarily have to be tied to a very close bond affection-wise, but I still do think that can be greatly enhanced by such a thing. Maybe that's mostly a human tendency, though.
My current Dane girl does her "happy dance" as greeting, before anything does or doesn't happen. When I'm putting her food down she stands with her backside presented, tail cocked. Unless I'm including table scraps; then all else is off.....
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7 hours ago, Equilibera said:
I'm really surprised that most don't seem to like "doggy style" all that much!
Just picking up on this because I didn't mention positions in my first response. In my experience most who express a preference for a position will express that preference for doggy style. There are definitely exceptions as Silverwolf1 points out and I too have experienced this but the vast majority of the girls I've been with have expressed a preference for doggy style. It is quite natural for them so this probably isn't much of a surprise. I always felt lucky that my own had no preference at all. It has led to us doing it just about everywhere it is possible to over the years [img]<fileStore.core_Emoticons>/emoticons/laugh.png[/img]/emoticons/ [email protected] 2x" title="xD" width="20" />
I'd also point out that Tippy and Shadow were the exceptions, not the rule. The other bitches I've been with have all pretty much wanted "doggy style". I really think size had most to do with it with my two long term lovers, both being rather petite Border Collies.
sw
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