Training or choice?

[WinterGreenWolf]

6 hours ago, DingoJay said:




 First, I need to mention that a majority of my experience is with dogs, primarily males.  I have had a fair number of dogs clearly show sexual interest in me, even on first meeting them.  We're not talking about random excitement or dominance mounting, but clearly visible arousal.   Others need to be shown that sexual behavior between them and myself is possible and acceptable.  Sure, that often as not involves a little gentle, manual stimulation. 




 As individuals, they can be interested or not and will clearly let me know.  Of course, I respect their wishes.  I have been told "NO!" in no uncertain terms by various animals, though some of them have offered themselves for sex or even solicited me at a later time.  Some of my dogs have come to me as older, neutered males who, at first, seemed uninterested, somewhat put-off or even a bit afraid but have come back for more later.  Others have been more like, "I don't want that, let's do this."  The most notable here was a Rotty many years ago who told me "Don't even THINK about touching my balls!  Oh, but here's my penis...  Give it a squeeze, you know you want to,"




  I don't use food as a bribe.  With dogs, at least, food tends to distract them from the business at hand.




 Getting to the bare bones of the topic...  Many people who I have encountered online insist that my dogs only engage in sex with me because they are trained to or "to please their master."  My usual reply to them is that if I could train my dogs to accept handling that they dislike or is uncomfortable to them, they would sit quietly for things like nail trimming or ear cleaning.  Getting out the nail clippers or the ear wash bottle is the best way I know of to witness the "Amazing Disappearing Dog Trick."

Though I haven't had a lot of partners (2, at this date) I can agree with you 100% here Dingo. Nail clipping is the bane of my shep's existence: and he actually likes foot rubs / pad massages.




There's a VERY clear difference between just 'please the master' training (usually involving fear or pain) and actual, willing, knowing involvement. The latter requiring some simple gentle guidance at times. I've had to wash my shep's ears a time or two due to a winter yeast infection (can be kind of common, depending on climate) and he doesn't mind, he likes having his ears rubbed first off, and secondly he's been guided and shown that it's a pleasant experience. The only part he doesn't like is giving his ears a gentle alcohol swab after a wash (the smell puts him off).




I've often been given the 'please the master' or 'bribed with food' argument with Antis, so I know how that one goes all too we.. [img]<fileStore.core_Emoticons>/emoticons/tongue.png[/img]/emoticons/[email protected] 2x" title=":P" width="20" />

[littlejohn]

I visit several zoo friends from time to time.  In every instance where there's a male zooey dog, they come for me very obviously. They Know somehow.  Some I'm granted permission to allow them their way with me, some are not, and I respect both of course.  I wonder how they know.

[DingoJay]

4 hours ago, littlejohn said:




 I wonder how they know.

 I have definitely noticed this, even in dogs who I'm fairly sure have not had sex with a human before.  I am thinking that it's one of two things: Either it's your body language that tips them off (dogs are very keen at observing humans' body language!) or perhaps it's pheromones, i.e. they can smell chemical changes as you become aroused.

[elshara]

14 minutes ago, DingoJay said:




 I have definitely noticed this, even in dogs who I'm fairly sure have not had sex with a human before.  I am thinking that it's one of two things: Either it's your body language that tips them off (dogs are very keen at observing humans' body language!) or perhaps it's pheromones, i.e. they can smell chemical changes as you become aroused.

Think it's a mixture of both and possibly older cents on you confirming your openness to be bred if you're active.

[Bear28]

I've never had to train any animal for sex. There have been a few animals in my past that i swear knew more about human animal sex then i did but I've never trained one. how would you even go about doing such a thing? 

[dog]

The commercial porn industry is known and has been documented to train animals for sex. That is a fact that undoubtedly continues today. They need money and they need the animals to perform. They care very little about the animals involved. 




Training animals for sex is wrong. It takes away the choice. I wrote an article on this topic and most people understand why it is wrong. Some do not though. That is because the online zoo community is mostly not made of zoophiles.